Chrysler 300M Enthusiasts Club
  • Doing a 4.0L Engine Swap

  • LH Performance Modification Discussions
25th Anniversary LH Platform Celebration

Membership Banner

LH Performance Modification Discussions
 #305324  by Shadowvox6
 April 23rd, 2013, 12:04 pm
Group...
I have been thinking about going this route, and swapping in a complete 4.0 engine into the M. My motor is getting up in mileage, and this might make more sense than to do a 4.0 cam/head installation on a 140k 3.5L motor.

If we swapped over everything from my 3.5 onto the 4.0, are there any issues (aside from the oil pan / oil filter issue that would need to be dealt with?
User avatar
 #305332  by LUNAT1C
 April 23rd, 2013, 12:50 pm
AFAIK the 4.0L was used in trucks and vans... I would be concerned with engine bay real estate, electronics, transaxle, mounts, etc. Etc.

Sent from my DROID RAZR HD using Tapatalk 2
 #305333  by Shadowvox6
 April 23rd, 2013, 1:23 pm
LUNAT1C wrote:AFAIK the 4.0L was used in trucks and vans... I would be concerned with engine bay real estate, electronics, transaxle, mounts, etc. Etc.

Sent from my DROID RAZR HD using Tapatalk 2
It is used with the 42RLE, and the NAG1 (IIRC) so the bell housing should bolt up.
Dimensionally, it is the same as the 3.5 block, so there shouldn't be any noticeable difference in engine bay room.
User avatar
 #305334  by LUNAT1C
 April 23rd, 2013, 2:33 pm
Hopefully then the intake and exhaust manifolds either fit or are adaptable/swappable, plus the accessories. That still leaves electronics and engine mounts though. The only other car I can think of that had the 3.5L was the Prowler... I think the Pacifica had both engines but the 3.5L in that one was different. Not sure if its mounts are similar. Having the same drivetrain certainly overcomes a large hurdle. This will certainly be a well-followed topic.
User avatar
 #305349  by Brando26
 April 23rd, 2013, 4:55 pm
Would you also need a compatible pcm, engine harness, etc... skim work?

Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk 2
User avatar
 #305369  by miska_man
 April 23rd, 2013, 11:03 pm
shadowvox6 wrote:It is used with the 42RLE, and the NAG1 (IIRC) so the bell housing should bolt up.
Dimensionally, it is the same as the 3.5 block, so there shouldn't be any noticeable difference in engine bay room.
NAG1/WA580 was in the 300 and was paired with the 3.5. I believe it was an option over the 42RLE (but if I recall it was just in like 40% of randomly chosen cars up until like '07 when they all had it?)

That of course was the RWD models. All AWD models with the 3.5 had the WA580 I believe.
User avatar
 #305434  by miska_man
 April 25th, 2013, 1:25 am
Tom, I'm wondering what would the advantage be of the 4.0? In stock form it only put out 260 hp/265ft'lbs in the Nitro. do they respond better to modding?
 #305447  by redmax
 April 25th, 2013, 10:40 am
Plus in my state changing the engine to a 4.0 would not allow the car to pass the state Inspection as the Vin number in the engine controller would not match the car's Vin as recorded by the state. It would fail the query when the state plugs into the OBD2 port to check the stored emission data and engine data recorded. The cars on board ECM computer would report a different engine up time, engine emission parameters, and a different VIN to the states computer, other than the data that was stored the last time that that cars VIN was inspected by the state. The Vin data the state uses comes from the scanned windshield sticker and the door jamb at the time of inspection, this tells the state what the car left the factory with, engine and emission wise. The engine up time would be assumed to be greater than the last inspection but if it was less than the last inspection it would also cause a problem. If anything fails during this process, a red box will appear on the inspectors screen stating the VIN mismatch, emission issues, or the engine up time discrepancy. At that time the inspector will not be allowed to proceed with the rest of the inspection until the "problem" is corrected. NYS requires cars to meet their emission standards which are the same as California but not the same as the rest of the 48, I had a heck of a time first registering my 02 Special in NYS as it was sold in AZ and did not comply with the NYS emission requirements, even though I had met the states exemptions on age and mileage. It can be very frustrating dealing with this state's laws.
 #305461  by Shadowvox6
 April 25th, 2013, 4:10 pm
redmax wrote:Plus in my state changing the engine to a 4.0 would not allow the car to pass the state Inspection as the Vin number in the engine controller would not match the car's Vin as recorded by the state. It would fail the query when the state plugs into the OBD2 port to check the stored emission data and engine data recorded. The cars on board ECM computer would report a different engine up time, engine emission parameters, and a different VIN to the states computer, other than the data that was stored the last time that that cars VIN was inspected by the state. The Vin data the state uses comes from the scanned windshield sticker and the door jamb at the time of inspection, this tells the state what the car left the factory with, engine and emission wise. The engine up time would be assumed to be greater than the last inspection but if it was less than the last inspection it would also cause a problem. If anything fails during this process, a red box will appear on the inspectors screen stating the VIN mismatch, emission issues, or the engine up time discrepancy. At that time the inspector will not be allowed to proceed with the rest of the inspection until the "problem" is corrected. NYS requires cars to meet their emission standards which are the same as California but not the same as the rest of the 48, I had a heck of a time first registering my 02 Special in NYS as it was sold in AZ and did not comply with the NYS emission requirements, even though I had met the states exemptions on age and mileage. It can be very frustrating dealing with this state's laws.
Not if you used the original PCM, and had the programming of it modified
 #305501  by dmondeac
 April 26th, 2013, 6:44 am
Tom, The engine will not fit with surgery to frame. Of course if you want to cut the frame and fab some mounts then anything is possible, (maybe a real Hemi).
User avatar
 #365743  by Basslicks
 March 13th, 2017, 9:22 am
Shadowvox6 wrote:Group...
I have been thinking about going this route, and swapping in a complete 4.0 engine into the M. My motor is getting up in mileage, and this might make more sense than to do a 4.0 cam/head installation on a 140k 3.5L motor.

If we swapped over everything from my 3.5 onto the 4.0, are there any issues (aside from the oil pan / oil filter issue that would need to be dealt with?

Old thread, I know.... but is this a common modification? 4.0 heads n cams on the 3.5l? Does this make it a stroker? I'd really like to know more.
User avatar
 #365745  by FIREM
 March 13th, 2017, 9:53 am
"Old thread, I know.... but is this a common modification? 4.0 heads n cams on the 3.5l? Does this make it a stroker? I'd really like to know more. "
NO Heads & Cams do not do it.
(note original poster, Tom/Shadowvox6 passed away 9/15)
'Stroker" refers to changing the crankshaft so that the piston travel is increased over the stock 3.5 and increases the displacement to 4.0.
It is a large, expensive, highly detail oriented undertaking. Of the 3 or 4 known to have been done, the one listed below is well documented as the best example of how to do it.
http://300mclub.org/forums/viewtopic.ph ... oker+build
http://www.dodgeintrepid.net/19-perform ... js=1#links
Basslicks liked this
User avatar
 #365748  by Basslicks
 March 13th, 2017, 12:06 pm
FIREM wrote:"Old thread, I know.... but is this a common modification? 4.0 heads n cams on the 3.5l? Does this make it a stroker? I'd really like to know more. "
NO Heads & Cams do not do it.
(note original poster, Tom/Shadowvox6 passed away 9/15)
'Stroker" refers to changing the crankshaft so that the piston travel is increased over the stock 3.5 and increases the displacement to 4.0.
It is a large, expensive, highly detail oriented undertaking. Of the 3 or 4 known to have been done, the one listed below is well documented as the best example of how to do it.
http://300mclub.org/forums/viewtopic.ph ... oker+build
http://www.dodgeintrepid.net/19-perform ... js=1#links
Oh man, sorry to hear that!

Okay, so referencing the 4.0 head/cam swap, does that do anything to increase power/torque? Is it even compatible? Just can't help but be curious where the idea came from.
User avatar
 #365751  by Basslicks
 March 13th, 2017, 1:30 pm
WHOOO!!!! Just looked up parts for doing that stroker build. Almost 900 bucks already and I don't even have all the parts he listed in my shopping cart!

Hurts my (wallet's) feelings a little..... :eek
User avatar
 #365753  by FIREM
 March 13th, 2017, 2:31 pm
I have spoken with Ron/dmondeac a lot about his build. Tons of $$ in the heads alone is where these engines benefit the most. Longer stroke helps in bottom end torque (acceleration) better breathing does well for the horsepower. Along with Nitrous his car is a rocket to say the least.
Long and short of the whole exercise is the trans/drivetrain layout of the LH cars is just not conducive to hot rodding.
Enjoy the decently powered, luxury touring. highway cruiser that they are.
If you want a hot rod, go quick, toy, there are better choices of cars that respond better to some tweaks than our LH's
Even the Prowler guys either spend tons and tons of money for crazy conversions or basically live the 3.5 as is.
Basslicks liked this